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	<title>Comments on: Vanguard, Past and Future</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.mobhunter.com/?feed=rss2&#038;p=124" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124</link>
	<description>A delicate blend of sarcasm and spite.</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mandrel</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22794</link>
		<dc:creator>Mandrel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 19:29:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22794</guid>
		<description>â€œThat said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.â€

Most importantly, his own limitations.  Not just the limitations of the project.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>â€œThat said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.â€</p>
<p>Most importantly, his own limitations.  Not just the limitations of the project.</p>
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		<title>By: To Touch the Sun &#171; The Kendricke Tracker</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22790</link>
		<dc:creator>To Touch the Sun &#171; The Kendricke Tracker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 19:05:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22790</guid>
		<description>[...] 17, 2007 Posted by kendricke in Sigil, The Gaming Industry, General Game Concepts. trackback  After making a comment yesterday on Moorgard&#8217;s blog, I decided to repost it here and expand upon it a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 17, 2007 Posted by kendricke in Sigil, The Gaming Industry, General Game Concepts. trackback  After making a comment yesterday on Moorgard&#8217;s blog, I decided to repost it here and expand upon it a [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Celestian</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22767</link>
		<dc:creator>Celestian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 17:55:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22767</guid>
		<description>Brad is guilty of not using the talent he had. Instead it appears that he and the upper management micro-managed every detail and didn&#039;t listen to the input of the employees. 

I find this very likely since I saw his early habits in EQ1.

Sorry I don&#039;t see Brad as some great innovator.  Sure he got the first real 3d mmo out there but the reason it did so well more than anything is it was the first. Brad is stuck in the past and refuses to see even things like instancing as next-gen.

All the self congratulations really is deep.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad is guilty of not using the talent he had. Instead it appears that he and the upper management micro-managed every detail and didn&#8217;t listen to the input of the employees. </p>
<p>I find this very likely since I saw his early habits in EQ1.</p>
<p>Sorry I don&#8217;t see Brad as some great innovator.  Sure he got the first real 3d mmo out there but the reason it did so well more than anything is it was the first. Brad is stuck in the past and refuses to see even things like instancing as next-gen.</p>
<p>All the self congratulations really is deep.</p>
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		<title>By: Nick McLaren</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22696</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick McLaren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 04:11:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22696</guid>
		<description>I was going to blog about this tonight, but Kendricke covered it so well, everybody ought to just read that instead :)

*tips hat*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was going to blog about this tonight, but Kendricke covered it so well, everybody ought to just read that instead <img src='http://www.mobhunter.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>*tips hat*</p>
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		<title>By: Kendricke</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22637</link>
		<dc:creator>Kendricke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 19:32:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22637</guid>
		<description>I usually do.  ;)

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I usually do.  <img src='http://www.mobhunter.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Moorgard</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22623</link>
		<dc:creator>Moorgard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 18:48:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22623</guid>
		<description>&quot;That said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.&quot;

Kendricke gets it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;That said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.&#8221;</p>
<p>Kendricke gets it.</p>
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		<title>By: Kendricke</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22622</link>
		<dc:creator>Kendricke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 18:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22622</guid>
		<description>&quot;Iâ€™m by no means implying analysis is the only thing that will make a better game. In fact, i think Sigilâ€™s analysis partially led to their downfall. They kept looking at individual things, and saying â€œwe can make this betterâ€ and then sold it as 3rd generation.&quot;

I&#039;d agree with that.  I&#039;d say that&#039;s a good way of putting it.  One gets the impression (after playing) that there&#039;s a whole lot of innovative ideas...that don&#039;t really go together very well in any wholistic sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Iâ€™m by no means implying analysis is the only thing that will make a better game. In fact, i think Sigilâ€™s analysis partially led to their downfall. They kept looking at individual things, and saying â€œwe can make this betterâ€ and then sold it as 3rd generation.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;d agree with that.  I&#8217;d say that&#8217;s a good way of putting it.  One gets the impression (after playing) that there&#8217;s a whole lot of innovative ideas&#8230;that don&#8217;t really go together very well in any wholistic sense.</p>
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		<title>By: Ralyssand</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22621</link>
		<dc:creator>Ralyssand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 18:32:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22621</guid>
		<description>&quot;Looking at what went right or wrong with other games gets you part of the way there. But no matter how good you are at analyzing other games, if you canâ€™t execute with skill and passion then all the analysis wonâ€™t do you a bit of good.&quot;
I&#039;m by no means implying analysis is the only thing that will make a better game. In fact, i think Sigil&#039;s analysis partially led to their downfall. They kept looking at individual things, and saying &quot;we can make this better&quot; and then sold it as 3rd generation. Analysis helps define the &quot;thesis&quot; for the paper you are writing, but only good writing and research can make it a good paper (seeing as how i think you said you were an english major, i thought you&#039;d appreciate that geeky analogy).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Looking at what went right or wrong with other games gets you part of the way there. But no matter how good you are at analyzing other games, if you canâ€™t execute with skill and passion then all the analysis wonâ€™t do you a bit of good.&#8221;<br />
I&#8217;m by no means implying analysis is the only thing that will make a better game. In fact, i think Sigil&#8217;s analysis partially led to their downfall. They kept looking at individual things, and saying &#8220;we can make this better&#8221; and then sold it as 3rd generation. Analysis helps define the &#8220;thesis&#8221; for the paper you are writing, but only good writing and research can make it a good paper (seeing as how i think you said you were an english major, i thought you&#8217;d appreciate that geeky analogy).</p>
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		<title>By: Kendricke</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22611</link>
		<dc:creator>Kendricke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 16:44:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22611</guid>
		<description>&quot;He who blinded by ambition, raises himself to a position whence he cannot mount higher, must thereafter fall with the greatest loss.&quot; -Niccolo Machiavelli 

I can&#039;t speak for what happened internally at Sigil anymore than any other non-employee could.  Everything I would comment on is strictly Monday morning quarterbacking.  

That said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.  I see this all the time at clients.  I come onboard and find that what they foresee happening and what I foresee as attaintable are often two completely separate beasts.  It&#039;s often my job to speak up with issues I see in the scope or &quot;vision&quot;, working often as a liason between engineers and sales/marketing/business groups - speaking up to state what can and can&#039;t be reasonably accomplished within a given time or budget.

For development companies, time is often inflexible to a great extent.  Release dates are often set very far in advance for a variety of reasons, and it&#039;s up to developers to make sure the work happens within that allotted time.  Since it&#039;s typically hard to pull in more cash resources, this leaves only two real constraints to work with:  labor hours and project scope.

With companies like SOE, they often pull a combination of the two, but at least with EQ2, they seem to reign in scope hard at times.  Entire dungeons or feature sets are scrapped for release dates, in order to put in the work necessary on the remaining content.  

For Sigil, this didn&#039;t seem to be as much of an option.  Sure, they scaled back a bit, but did the game really need to launch with that many continents and starting areas?  Did the game really need to launch with that many races and classes?  Did the game really need to have that many features?

From an outsider&#039;s point of view, it appeared that Sigil was almost afraid to touch scope to any great extent.  Was this due to scope being equated to &quot;Vision (TM)&quot;?  A wiser man than I once commented on game design that &quot;there are no sacred cows&quot;.  With Sigil, it seems they were unable to destroy the myriad of idols that had been propped up before them by McQuaid.  

There&#039;s no denying his vision of an MMO was great indeed.  He certainly painted a beautiful portrait in our minds of what such a fanciful flight could truly be like.  The problem is that, like Icarus, Brad attempted to fly too high too fast with this initial release.  

Five years and thirty million dollars.  Even in a post-Warcraft market, that&#039;s still a respectable amount of investment for any MMO.  Yet, even with a staff of ~100 putting in inhuman hours, the project was simply too large in scope to handle.  It needed to be reigned in.  Cuts needed to be made earlier.  Risks weren&#039;t properly identified soon enough, and even if they were, they weren&#039;t acted upon.

Customers are more saavy and the market is simply too diverse these days for a mediocre or substandard quality of product to be delivered for release.  Games such as World of Warcraft have simply raised the bar on polish while lowering the bar for entry requirements.  As Sigil&#039;s rise and inevitable fall shows us, companies ignore these facts at their own peril.  

Before you build a beautiful house, you must first construct a rock solid foundation.  The more successful studios do this.  You start relatively small and expand later on.  You make sure your workers have the right tools for the job.  

Reports coming out now indicate Sigil did not do any of this.  If sources are to be believed, it would seem that Sigil started building too many parts of the house at the same time, and never managed to put the foundation in properly in the first place, all while supplying their workers with nothing better than hand tools, and giving them an unrealistic timetable to meet.  

When the owners finally showed up to take the keys, they were initially excited to see what a large house was built (over and above what theyd&#039; intially hoped for) and then appalled to find the plumbing leaked, the shower had no pressure, there was no toilet in the master bathroom, and the roof only covered 95% of the top floor.  

Sure, the workers offered to stay on and complete the repairs, but by that point, the owners had gone elsewhere to live.  This was the house that McQuaid built.  This was to be his legacy:  he sold us on a dream home, and delivered to us a fixer-upper.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;He who blinded by ambition, raises himself to a position whence he cannot mount higher, must thereafter fall with the greatest loss.&#8221; -Niccolo Machiavelli </p>
<p>I can&#8217;t speak for what happened internally at Sigil anymore than any other non-employee could.  Everything I would comment on is strictly Monday morning quarterbacking.  </p>
<p>That said, if Brad is really guilty of anything here, it was reaching beyond reasonable limitations.  I see this all the time at clients.  I come onboard and find that what they foresee happening and what I foresee as attaintable are often two completely separate beasts.  It&#8217;s often my job to speak up with issues I see in the scope or &#8220;vision&#8221;, working often as a liason between engineers and sales/marketing/business groups &#8211; speaking up to state what can and can&#8217;t be reasonably accomplished within a given time or budget.</p>
<p>For development companies, time is often inflexible to a great extent.  Release dates are often set very far in advance for a variety of reasons, and it&#8217;s up to developers to make sure the work happens within that allotted time.  Since it&#8217;s typically hard to pull in more cash resources, this leaves only two real constraints to work with:  labor hours and project scope.</p>
<p>With companies like SOE, they often pull a combination of the two, but at least with EQ2, they seem to reign in scope hard at times.  Entire dungeons or feature sets are scrapped for release dates, in order to put in the work necessary on the remaining content.  </p>
<p>For Sigil, this didn&#8217;t seem to be as much of an option.  Sure, they scaled back a bit, but did the game really need to launch with that many continents and starting areas?  Did the game really need to launch with that many races and classes?  Did the game really need to have that many features?</p>
<p>From an outsider&#8217;s point of view, it appeared that Sigil was almost afraid to touch scope to any great extent.  Was this due to scope being equated to &#8220;Vision (TM)&#8221;?  A wiser man than I once commented on game design that &#8220;there are no sacred cows&#8221;.  With Sigil, it seems they were unable to destroy the myriad of idols that had been propped up before them by McQuaid.  </p>
<p>There&#8217;s no denying his vision of an MMO was great indeed.  He certainly painted a beautiful portrait in our minds of what such a fanciful flight could truly be like.  The problem is that, like Icarus, Brad attempted to fly too high too fast with this initial release.  </p>
<p>Five years and thirty million dollars.  Even in a post-Warcraft market, that&#8217;s still a respectable amount of investment for any MMO.  Yet, even with a staff of ~100 putting in inhuman hours, the project was simply too large in scope to handle.  It needed to be reigned in.  Cuts needed to be made earlier.  Risks weren&#8217;t properly identified soon enough, and even if they were, they weren&#8217;t acted upon.</p>
<p>Customers are more saavy and the market is simply too diverse these days for a mediocre or substandard quality of product to be delivered for release.  Games such as World of Warcraft have simply raised the bar on polish while lowering the bar for entry requirements.  As Sigil&#8217;s rise and inevitable fall shows us, companies ignore these facts at their own peril.  </p>
<p>Before you build a beautiful house, you must first construct a rock solid foundation.  The more successful studios do this.  You start relatively small and expand later on.  You make sure your workers have the right tools for the job.  </p>
<p>Reports coming out now indicate Sigil did not do any of this.  If sources are to be believed, it would seem that Sigil started building too many parts of the house at the same time, and never managed to put the foundation in properly in the first place, all while supplying their workers with nothing better than hand tools, and giving them an unrealistic timetable to meet.  </p>
<p>When the owners finally showed up to take the keys, they were initially excited to see what a large house was built (over and above what theyd&#8217; intially hoped for) and then appalled to find the plumbing leaked, the shower had no pressure, there was no toilet in the master bathroom, and the roof only covered 95% of the top floor.  </p>
<p>Sure, the workers offered to stay on and complete the repairs, but by that point, the owners had gone elsewhere to live.  This was the house that McQuaid built.  This was to be his legacy:  he sold us on a dream home, and delivered to us a fixer-upper.</p>
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		<title>By: Moorgard</title>
		<link>http://www.mobhunter.com/?p=124&#038;cpage=1#comment-22610</link>
		<dc:creator>Moorgard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 16:36:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moorgard.com/?p=124#comment-22610</guid>
		<description>What people sometimes fail to appreciate is that the line between greatness and failure in any art form is often immeasurably small. The elements that make one thing (movie, game, book, etc.) greater than another are often so subtle that they can&#039;t be put into words beyond &quot;this is just better.&quot;

So game designers can proclaim all day long how they&#039;ve learned lessons from the past and will do things right next time. But ultimately it comes down to consistency of execution in ways that are very very hard to define.

Looking at what went right or wrong with other games gets you part of the way there. But no matter how good you are at analyzing other games, if you can&#039;t execute with skill and passion then all the analysis won&#039;t do you a bit of good.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What people sometimes fail to appreciate is that the line between greatness and failure in any art form is often immeasurably small. The elements that make one thing (movie, game, book, etc.) greater than another are often so subtle that they can&#8217;t be put into words beyond &#8220;this is just better.&#8221;</p>
<p>So game designers can proclaim all day long how they&#8217;ve learned lessons from the past and will do things right next time. But ultimately it comes down to consistency of execution in ways that are very very hard to define.</p>
<p>Looking at what went right or wrong with other games gets you part of the way there. But no matter how good you are at analyzing other games, if you can&#8217;t execute with skill and passion then all the analysis won&#8217;t do you a bit of good.</p>
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